Apple Pencils can’t draw straight on third-party replacement iPad screens
- Thread starter JournalBot
- Start date
Upvote
27
(69
/
-42)
Can't or won't? I'm surprised that Apple management still hasn't figured out which way the wind is blowing on the topic of repairability. How much money can they possibly be making on repairs? Is it really worth these shenanigans?
Upvote
78
(95
/
-17)
This: '"They have a memory chip that sits on the screen that's programmed to only allow the Pencil functionality to work if the screen is connected to the original logic board," Panesar told Forbes.'
...makes no sense. It seems far more likely that it's a matter of the Pencil and digitizer not being calibrated exactly correctly to each other. I could see having a per-screen calibration that goes with each Apple part - in fact, since their screens are factory-calibrated for color - I expect it, but a chip that's specifically programmed to sabotage third-party parts? I don't buy it.
...makes no sense. It seems far more likely that it's a matter of the Pencil and digitizer not being calibrated exactly correctly to each other. I could see having a per-screen calibration that goes with each Apple part - in fact, since their screens are factory-calibrated for color - I expect it, but a chip that's specifically programmed to sabotage third-party parts? I don't buy it.
Upvote
189
(232
/
-43)
DRM is everywhere and is usually used to prevent 3rd party repair and parts. just look at what john deer does.
Upvote
-13
(48
/
-61)
These stories are always conflicting to me. On the one hand, counterfeit parts can range the gamut from harmless to harmful, both in a security/privacy sense and a physical one. On the other hand, swapping one genuine Apple part for another should be doable and retain all the features.
Other touchscreens I've replaced have had the calibration built-in to the device. iOS has never had that consumer-capability. (Then again, even the oldest iOS touchscreens have never drifted.) With all the negative press this continues to generate, Apple should consider allowing people— maybe even through their parts replacement program— to access calibration software. Doing it in a way that keeps the security of iOS devices intact is probably a challenge, but it's not impossible.
Other touchscreens I've replaced have had the calibration built-in to the device. iOS has never had that consumer-capability. (Then again, even the oldest iOS touchscreens have never drifted.) With all the negative press this continues to generate, Apple should consider allowing people— maybe even through their parts replacement program— to access calibration software. Doing it in a way that keeps the security of iOS devices intact is probably a challenge, but it's not impossible.
Upvote
51
(56
/
-5)
While I could see Apple sabotaging third-party repairs, since they've done it before, the fact that the Pencil largely works but doesn't quite draw straight suggests you're right. I don't think this is a tinfoil hat moment.
Upvote
105
(123
/
-18)
Assuming Apple is doing something to effectively require official Apple parts or service technicians to repair a device, I would not be in favor of giving Apple a pass for such behavior. The underlying principles of capitalism require that there be an open and competitive market place to serve as a check and balance on the system. You know, the principles that are espoused but don't happen in reality due to monopolies or near monopolies, i.e. mature markets.
Upvote
-1
(28
/
-29)
Did you watch the linked video?
Broken screen + chip = straight
New screen + new chip = jagged
New screen + old chip = straight
If this were just digitizer calibration, the lines would be offset, not jagged and new screen + old chip shouldn't have fixed it
ETA: I'm not saying it's a purposeful design to hamper 3rd party devices; it could be but without more info I couldn't say.
I'm not sure the pen is actually part of the serialization process, so I'm retracting my WAG.
These are all genuine Apple Parts, just not serialized/authorized to work together. Just because it may not be malicious intent, doesn't mean it isn't stupid and anti-consumer.
Last edited:
Upvote
70
(93
/
-23)
To add a cost to every unit sale in order to protect the margins on repair parts for a fraction of total unit sales doesn’t make a lot of financial sense. The failure rates are low enough that the margins on the replacement parts would have to be incredible to offset that cost.
I’m all for third party replacement parts being allowed for everything outside the security stack. I see more risk than benefit in something like the TouchID sensor being allowed to be third party. It’s a very tempting attack vector.
Upvote
5
(14
/
-9)
It’s not about profiting from the repair, it’s about keeping repair prices high enough to push consumers to buy new replacements rather than repairing.
Case in point, I dropped my iPhone XS and damaged the display connector, causing a line to run down the screen. If I get it repaired by Apple, it’ll cost $279. It’s pointless to pay that much to repair a 5 year old phone that’s near the end of its support life, so I’ll probably just end up replacing it instead.
Apple knows this, which is why there’s a mandatory sales pitch you have to sit through almost any time to bring in a handheld device that’s more than a few years old.
ETA: On a related note, I’ve noticed that Apple has become extremely pushy about trying to remove old devices from circulation as well. When my wife upgraded from a 6S to a 13, the sales person spent more time trying to sell us on handing over the 6S than he did on selling the 13.
Last edited:
Upvote
32
(60
/
-28)
The reality of our world is that Apple has real world data that suggests that bad actors would love to bypass their security (may it be governments wanting to pry into journalist's devices, or just thieves wanting to wipe a stolen device <- the far bigger threat). Quoting a rep for a repair service as if they were stating facts and handwaving at Apple's stance is not doing any favors to the narrative of "it's complicated and many of us would like to repair our devices but many of us equally like the security that comes with the current setup"
Saying "it would be easy for Apple to build security and repairability" is
a) the exact same argument used by the various lobbyist (FBI, UK Government, etc) that want back doors to E2E encryption.
b) dismissing that those are not the only two design parameters that Apple has to consider (e.g. waterproofing)
Saying "it would be easy for Apple to build security and repairability" is
a) the exact same argument used by the various lobbyist (FBI, UK Government, etc) that want back doors to E2E encryption.
b) dismissing that those are not the only two design parameters that Apple has to consider (e.g. waterproofing)
Upvote
44
(69
/
-25)
Doubt it. Bet it's just a "I'd rather have an entire small pie than a small piece of a bigger pie" mentality from those so far removed from the front lines that they probably think that baseboard elves come in and fix their broken crap during the night.
Upvote
-8
(5
/
-13)
The alternative but at least as accurate headline “Third party screens break Apple Pencil functionality” would surely garner fewer clicks.
Upvote
-18
(23
/
-41)
I am sure that Apple builds their devices to have such expensive repair costs just so that they can get YOU. Their entire supply chain is built around that one gotcha.
/s
Alternately, they sell a quarter billion iPhones sold every year. Of those, what percentage break? Do you really think that percentage of upgrades (a rounding error in their global sales number) is worth it to Apple? Apple gets repeat customers because of customer satisfaction, sometimes they lose customers because their service does not align, but mostly they do what their customers want.
Upvote
-18
(24
/
-42)
And miss out on the profits of overpriced repairs and suggesting consumers on buying a new apple device?
Upvote
-5
(19
/
-24)
The video does not show a third party screen. It shows an Apple iPad screen pulled from a different Apple iPad.
Upvote
46
(50
/
-4)
Maybe we can circle back to this discussion after you get to the reading comprehension part of your SAT prep book.
Upvote
-14
(12
/
-26)
Ting Mobile Supports Your Right to Repair with Launch of "Epic Phone Fails" Campaign and Broken Phone Payback Program
/PRNewswire/ -- Did you know that you have a "Right to Repair" your tech items? According to results from the "Epic Phone Fails" survey released today by Ting...
Old survey and smaller US carrier, but there's a lot of damaged phones out there.
Upvote
4
(8
/
-4)
Did you even read the article? I strongly suggest you do as you are wrong.
Apple is already known to serialize components, this is not in dispute, and yet you choose to dispute it.
Upvote
-1
(22
/
-23)
The video in the article used a genuine apple screen and it didn't work. Then they replaced a single little chip in the new screen with the chip from the old, broken screen, and everything worked again.
Use expensive shit, genuine apple parts without apple's magic blessing, get shit performance.
Upvote
51
(64
/
-13)
What ? Maximizing profits (which is any company's goal, whatever their PR) with devices that last longer means increasing the long tail ie apps, content, payments, and maintenance. Apple certainly works at getting more revenue from repairs: design, HW drm, lawsuits towards 3rd parties and parts importers, over-quotes from their tech support...
Last I checked, phone screen breakage is 15%/yr. at 1 billion devices, $150-$400 per screen @80% profit, I'll take it.
Upvote
-7
(8
/
-15)
There are a lot of naive people in this thread who act like Apple hasn't done this before or that Apple is above such tactics when explicit examples of it are given in the article. Device repair is a fight they've taken up against for a long time despite all of the corporate green-washing they do. Guilty until proven innocent IMO.
Upvote
16
(41
/
-25)
I'm very confused. The three sets of lines look the same to me, but I guess the blue ones are supposed to be different?
Upvote
4
(5
/
-1)
This is pretty much it. The old chip has calibration values from the old screen. The new chip is possibly identical but has no calibration values. When swapped with the old chip it performs better because the calibration values from the old screen are better than blank values for the new screen.
So it's not malicious, just not designed for repair. Hanlon's razor applies here somewhat.
Upvote
35
(61
/
-26)
Why would the new screen chip be blank? It's pulled from a working iPad. If it's blank, they're both blank.
Upvote
36
(44
/
-8)
Earlier this year I took my son’s iPad mini 5 in to ask for repair. It had some scratches on the screen and a small crack near the bottom of the screen. All I wanted was a screen replacement.
The rep told me that they couldn’t repair the screen. Instead I could get “up to” $150 to trade it in for a new iPad.
I pressed the rep about a repair and they wouldn’t budge. Saying they couldn’t do it.
Apple needs a kick in the face for this crap.
The rep told me that they couldn’t repair the screen. Instead I could get “up to” $150 to trade it in for a new iPad.
I pressed the rep about a repair and they wouldn’t budge. Saying they couldn’t do it.
Apple needs a kick in the face for this crap.
Upvote
38
(46
/
-8)
A similar mentality was common for PowerBook/MacBook batteries back when those were easily replaceable. People would look at the price of an OEM battery, balk at it, go buy a $25 bargain bin special battery off of Amazon or eBay, and then act surprised when their laptop started acting wonky or in a few cases got fried.
Yes there's some margin on official parts, but a lot of the extra cost goes toward quality control. They're more expensive because defective or otherwise subpar units are rejected. Cheap parts are cheap because everything that rolls off the assembly line is sold, or in some cases because they're the units that were rejected by the OEM and have problems.
This isn't exclusive to Apple, either, which can be frustrating. For older gadgets sometimes the only thing you can get are junky third party replacement parts, especially when it comes to batteries and devices that didn't sell in vast quantities.
Upvote
16
(33
/
-17)
It isn't purely about direct profit from repair and replacements, by making repairs expensive, they incentivise customers to buy Apples extended warranty. It is also about control, not so much ensuring that repairs are done correctly, but about ensuring that customers interface with Apple as much as possible. Every time a customer comes into an Apple store, there is a chance that they will make an additional purchase, I am also willing to bet that the act of visiting an Apple store, even if no purchase is made right away, is likely to, on average, increase the chance of a purchase in the following days, weeks, and months.
Upvote
16
(23
/
-7)
I have questions about this. . . I am not really familiar with the Apple Pencil. . .
1) Is it supposed to automatically straighten your lines for you? I know that I can't really draw a straight line by hand - I always get slight curve/squiggle, and if trying to draw a particularly long line, it's much more likely to wander around.
2) Why don't they use a straight edge in their testing? Like lay a ruler or something down on the screen to run the pencil along, to see if it's really creating false squiggles, or it's just slight squiggle in the motion of the hand of the person trying to draw the line? Unless the answer to number 2 is that the answer to number 1 is 'yes', in which case the device should be straightening the line for you?
1) Is it supposed to automatically straighten your lines for you? I know that I can't really draw a straight line by hand - I always get slight curve/squiggle, and if trying to draw a particularly long line, it's much more likely to wander around.
2) Why don't they use a straight edge in their testing? Like lay a ruler or something down on the screen to run the pencil along, to see if it's really creating false squiggles, or it's just slight squiggle in the motion of the hand of the person trying to draw the line? Unless the answer to number 2 is that the answer to number 1 is 'yes', in which case the device should be straightening the line for you?
Upvote
15
(16
/
-1)